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Old 01-12-2018, 05:08 PM   #1
Outstretched
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Default A few questions about buying resale

Looking at buying a resale contract at Boardwalk Villas. I anticipate my needs to be around 100-200 points a year (going no more than twice a year for a week).

#1 - I see a contract for 400 points available. Assuming no change in Disney's point renting policy, I could rent the other ~200 points out and going by a rate of $14/point, could have it pay for itself in 7 years (not including annual dues). I could also have the points available to me in case I want to splurge one year or give the points to a friend. Is there any drawback or risk to doing this? (I have investments in the stock market and real estate already so I don't mind spending the extra money on this if it's a good idea.)

#2 - The contract I'm looking at banked 122 points from 2019 into 2018. I wouldn't need them. Can I "un-bank" these points and move them back to 2019 or would I have to use them/rent them out this year?

#3 - How do I know I'm getting a good deal? Is the thread with monthly DVC resale data a good barometer?

Thank you all.
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Old 01-12-2018, 05:29 PM   #2
JudieHopps
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Sounds like a good plan if you can do it.
You never know, once you stay in a one bedroom you may be happy you have the extra points!
Once points are banked they are banked.
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Old 01-12-2018, 06:22 PM   #3
disney65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outstretched View Post
Looking at buying a resale contract at Boardwalk Villas. I anticipate my needs to be around 100-200 points a year (going no more than twice a year for a week).

#1 - I see a contract for 400 points available. Assuming no change in Disney's point renting policy, I could rent the other ~200 points out and going by a rate of $14/point, could have it pay for itself in 7 years (not including annual dues). I could also have the points available to me in case I want to splurge one year or give the points to a friend. Is there any drawback or risk to doing this? (I have investments in the stock market and real estate already so I don't mind spending the extra money on this if it's a good idea.)

#2 - The contract I'm looking at banked 122 points from 2019 into 2018. I wouldn't need them. Can I "un-bank" these points and move them back to 2019 or would I have to use them/rent them out this year?

#3 - How do I know I'm getting a good deal? Is the thread with monthly DVC resale data a good barometer?

Thank you all.
If you rent yourself you can get more then $14/pp

Always keep in mind if you are not able to rent your mind, you should be in position to pay for dues and use points for yourself, if yes then you can buy larger contracts.

Borrowed pts can not be return back to original use yr, so you have to use them in the yr they borrowed in to.

ROFR thread is good place to start looking at resale data.

Best wishes.
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Old 01-12-2018, 06:23 PM   #4
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#1 Another way to think about it is that if you buy 400 points and rent out 200 points per year, the rent will cover your annual dues, since the annual dues on 400 points are $2620 and you can rent 200 points out for $14.50 per point quite easily which will get you $2900. And as you say it's nice to have the option to spend more points on vacations if you want to.
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Old 01-12-2018, 06:33 PM   #5
mustinjourney
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There are many more people that wish they had bought more points sooner than later, which is one reason to go ahead with this purchase.

However, a 400 point contract will be harder to sell later on. So just me mindful that if you do decide to sell in the future, you will have a harder time selling a 400 point contract as compared to a 100-150 point contract.

I think BWV contracts are going for between $105-$120 depending on size and how many points are available. Since the contract is on the larger end and it has points BORROWED (not banked) into the current UY from 2019, that should also make the contract price go down.

All that said -- I anticipate BWV prices to keep going up for the next couple years. That location is going to become very hot with the new Star wars land opening. Riviera DVC might take some of the luster away, but Riviera still won't be able to walk to either DHS or Epcot like you can at BWV.

Therefore, even if it's not the greatest deal out there -- if it works for you and you're happy -- go for it! Don't worry about getting the best deal possible.
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Old 01-12-2018, 07:04 PM   #6
Kerri jo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by disney65 View Post
If you rent yourself you can get more then $14/pp

Always keep in mind if you are not able to rent your mind, you should be in position to pay for dues and use points for yourself, if yes then you can buy larger contracts.

Borrowed pts can not be return back to original use yr, so you have to use them in the yr they borrowed in to.

ROFR thread is good place to start looking at resale data.

Best wishes.
and will caution that many first-time MOs have been known to grossly underestimate the # of points they "need" (myself included!)
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Old 01-12-2018, 07:13 PM   #7
Outstretched
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Forgot to ask this question. If I wind up with an odd, small amount of points left over, can they be successfully rented out? In other words, can a renter combine points from multiple sources to make a reservation.
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Old 01-12-2018, 07:27 PM   #8
cornbread4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outstretched View Post
Looking at buying a resale contract at Boardwalk Villas. I anticipate my needs to be around 100-200 points a year (going no more than twice a year for a week).

#1 - I see a contract for 400 points available. Assuming no change in Disney's point renting policy, I could rent the other ~200 points out and going by a rate of $14/point, could have it pay for itself in 7 years (not including annual dues). I could also have the points available to me in case I want to splurge one year or give the points to a friend. Is there any drawback or risk to doing this? (I have investments in the stock market and real estate already so I don't mind spending the extra money on this if it's a good idea.)

#2 - The contract I'm looking at banked 122 points from 2019 into 2018. I wouldn't need them. Can I "un-bank" these points and move them back to 2019 or would I have to use them/rent them out this year?

#3 - How do I know I'm getting a good deal? Is the thread with monthly DVC resale data a good barometer?

Thank you all.
I can sympathize as a recent BWV buyer from the fall. The monthly resale data is good as a reference, or look at the ROFR threads for 2018 and late 2017. That will show you recent prices paid. Keep in mind that contracts can be fully loaded (last year's points banked, this year's points, and next year's points avail), or fully stripped ((last years, this year's, and next year's all used). Fully loaded go for a bit more, stripped for a bit less.

For rental, keep in mind your time horizon. With BWV, it's only til 2042, but that's still ~25 years. Conditions could change more than once in that timeframe.
- The rental market is strong now, but so is the economy. During any recessions, demand will drop and you might not be able to rent, or might have to price drop to do so.
- As more DVC resorts get added, there's more rooms that need to be filled. It's not an issue now, particularly at hot properties like BWV which can be difficult to book at 7 months out (when it opens to all owners). But this could make the next recession have an increased impact on rental rates.
- Disney could also make changes that could make renting more difficult.
- State or local governments could change rental laws and start collecting taxes on timeshare rentals
- Rental prices might not keep pace with maintenance fee increases in which case your income might be less than expected (but still positive). Maintenance fees could also spike from increased costs to maintain an older resort.
- At some point, resale prices for all resorts are likely to tank as you get close to expiration. How soon? We haven't gotten there for any resort yet. BWV will be among the first to experience it. If you hold until it expires, this won't have an impact. But if you're planning to sell to recoup some of your cost, or are considering that a option available to you, keep in mind there is some uncertainty around it.
- As early buyers get older, we could reach a tipping point where more want to sell than are being replaced by the next generation. This could affect resale prices, and rental demand.
- Finally, rental income is taxable. There's plenty of separate threads discussing this. For this post, just consider that the more you rent, the more it becomes a potential concern, and reporting might be out of your hands as state, government gets better at identifying and tracking historically unreported income types.

If you're counting on renting half of your points for 25 years, there is some risk there. If current conditions continue, you'll be sitting pretty with the rental of the extra points recouping much of your original investment. If not, you may not recoup as much of your higher purchase cost as expected and be on the hook for more maintenance fees. You could get caught with points you can't use, or you end up spending more at time & money at Disney than originally planned.

Now- DVC has certainly proved to be a much better investment than most time shares both in holding value (& increasing!) and in having a strong rental market. It's worked out particularly well for those who bought in earlier at much lower prices. There's certainly a good chance that will continue. But just keep in mind it's not guaranteed, and that some of the current conditions might change over your 25 year horizon. Alternative investments also have risk. So I'm not trying to talk you out of it or denigrate DVC. We're still very happy with our decision to buy resale and look forward to many years of usage with some periodic rental of unused points. This is just a different kind of investment, so I wanted to pass on the types of things to consider that might not all readily be apparent.

Good luck with your purchase!
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Old 01-12-2018, 07:27 PM   #9
Kerri jo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outstretched View Post
Forgot to ask this question. If I wind up with an odd, small amount of points left over, can they be successfully rented out? In other words, can a renter combine points from multiple sources to make a reservation.
Renters cannot, but you as the owner are able to purchase up to 24 OTUP (one-time use points) per year from Disney to build up enough for one night in most resorts. I think they are up to $17 per point now, but don't quote me on that!
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Old 01-12-2018, 07:29 PM   #10
cornbread4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outstretched View Post
Forgot to ask this question. If I wind up with an odd, small amount of points left over, can they be successfully rented out? In other words, can a renter combine points from multiple sources to make a reservation.
The DVC system has a lot of flexibility. You can bank unused points forward and borrow from future years.

All points have to be from the same owner. A renter can't use 50 points from owner A & 50 points from owner B for one reservation. But they could have owner A reserve a 2 night reservation, and owner B reserve a second reservation.

If renting out 7-11 months ahead of time, they all have to be from the same resort. I.e. you can't combine BWV & SSR points for a BWV reservation 10 months out.
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