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Old 09-14-2020, 02:36 PM   #751
Nickys
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Originally Posted by CarolA View Post
You have posted the only post Iíve ever seen where a renter actually got cashback. what they usually get A worthless voucher .
Nope, I was another owner who cancelled right at the beginning and the renter got a full refund. For the first couple of weeks or so he was refunding where owners agreed to refund. His problem was not all owners were able or willing to do so.

At some point later he then started the voucher system. I suspect he thought, or was advised, that to refund some renters (where the owners were refunding) but not others (where the owners couldnít or wouldnít refund) was unfair.

The voucher scheme is being used by both main brokers.
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Old 09-14-2020, 04:05 PM   #752
Jstarr
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Have you been reading this thread. David is doing the right thing to make sure David gets paid. If a renter and owner get screwed too bad so sad but David got his money. If you believe David is looking out for your best interest I’ve got a bridge for sale
Honestly, I have not read the entire thread, just bits and pieces. But, it is clear from what I’ve read enough to realize that many on this thread are pontifficating with a pretty heavy bias without actually having experienced the situation. I have and I thought David’s the best he could have done for me - I kept my original 70% and he re-rented even more points for me for a 2021 reservation and gave me the difference.

They asked me in early April to refund my original 70%. I told them I would think about it. By the time Disney canceled the reservations April 19, they only asked for me to re-rent my points and gave the rented a voucher. I assumed that was ok for them.

Having owned a few businesses, I understand all too well that cash flow is a huge problem for a small business. And when there is no demand for your service, a voucher, IMHO, is the best they could do as it sounds like most sellers were giving much push-back on returning deposits. For the record I was going to give the $ back but at that point I wasn’t asked to. Now, if they don’t honor them that is a different story. But for me, I was satisfied with my outcome and will continue to trust them until they prove otherwise to me.

Which is the other broker issuing vouchers? Are they getting the same negative reviews?

Last edited by Jstarr; 09-15-2020 at 09:08 AM. Reason: Clarification
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Old 09-15-2020, 05:51 PM   #753
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Originally Posted by Jstarr View Post
Honestly, I have not read the entire thread, just bits and pieces. But, it is clear from what I’ve read enough to realize that many on this thread are pontifficating with a pretty heavy bias without actually having experienced the situation. I have and I thought David’s the best he could have done for me - I kept my original 70% and he re-rented even more points for me for a 2021 reservation and gave me the difference.

They asked me in early April to refund my original 70%. I told them I would think about it. By the time Disney canceled the reservations April 19, they only asked for me to re-rent my points and gave the rented a voucher. I assumed that was ok for them.

Having owned a few businesses, I understand all too well that cash flow is a huge problem for a small business. And when there is no demand for your service, a voucher, IMHO, is the best they could do as it sounds like most sellers were giving much push-back on returning deposits. For the record I was going to give the $ back but at that point I wasn’t asked to. Now, if they don’t honor them that is a different story. But for me, I was satisfied with my outcome and will continue to trust them until they prove otherwise to me.

Which is the other broker issuing vouchers? Are they getting the same negative reviews?
Your first sentence says a lot. The 'pontificating' part is offensive. I offered David's on April 9 a full refund of everything that had come to me (for a July reservation, that I had done the previous November) but told them that they needed to make a decision by April EOM so I could roll over. Davids said they weren't interested -- ok. But when Disney cancelled the reservation in July (something you could've seen happening in April), they wanted their money back OR I had the choice of re-renting taking on more liability than I would've before. Not happening and as far as I'm concerned, the 70% is the price for holding a reservation from November to July, esp since I gave them the option of cashing out completely in April. So read the threads before you start laying on 'pontificating'

Last edited by lalimom; 09-15-2020 at 11:53 PM.
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Old 09-15-2020, 09:22 PM   #754
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Originally Posted by lalimom View Post
Your first sentence says a lot. The 'pontificating' part is offensive. I offered David's in April a full refund of everything that had come to me (for a July reservation, that I had done the previous November) but told them that they needed to make a decision by mid-May so I could roll over. Davids said they weren't interested -- ok. But when Disney cancelled the reservation in July (something you could've seen happening in April), they wanted their money back OR I had the choice of re-renting taking on more liability than I would've before. Not happening and as far as I'm concerned, the 70% is the price for holding a reservation from November to July, esp since I gave them the option of cashing out completely in April. So read the threads before you start laying on 'pontificating'
So, you kept the 70% and you kept your points?
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Old 09-15-2020, 11:28 PM   #755
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So, you kept the 70% and you kept your points?
you quite conveniently skip over the part that i offered them a full refund in April. Why ignore that? I gave them a chance to be made whole, Davids instead decided to roll the dice and in this case, lost. I also offered in July to refund the client directly. They said no, they had offered a voucher, client was happy. So much for your smirky response.

What did I give up when I rented my points in November under a "no refund" scenario? I gave up the option of selling my contract before the reservation date while maintaining the obligation to keep paying the annual fees associated with those points. So I got 70% of 14.50 per point less 8 for annual fees...clearing a little less than $3 per point. What do you think the (option) value of reserving points for 8 months should be? Zero? If so, you don't understand how option pricing works.

So, yes, I got my points back--all of which I paid $8ish in 2020 to maintain. And if it makes you happy, a large chunk of which will expire in November. Now, again, having offered to refund 100% in April and being turned down, my conscience is pretty clear. I do plan to check in with the client in a year to see if they used the voucher and have a discussion with them at that point. But Davids -- they can take a long walk off a short pier.

Last edited by lalimom; 09-16-2020 at 12:16 AM.
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Old 09-16-2020, 12:30 AM   #756
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Originally Posted by lalimom View Post
you quite conveniently skip over the part that i offered them a full refund in April. Why ignore that? I gave them a chance to be made whole, Davids instead decided to roll the dice and in this case, lost. I also offered in July to refund the client directly. They said no, they had offered a voucher, client was happy. So much for your smirky response.

What did I give up when I rented my points in November under a "no refund" scenario? I gave up the option of selling my contract before the reservation date while maintaining the obligation to keep paying the annual fees associated with those points. So I got 70% of 14.50 per point less 8 for annual fees...clearing a little less than $3 per point. What do you think the (option) value of reserving points for 8 months should be? Zero? If so, you don't understand how option pricing works.

So, yes, I got my points back--all of which I paid $8ish in 2020 to maintain. And if it makes you happy, a large chunk of which will expire in November. Now, again, having offered to refund 100% in April and being turned down, my conscience is pretty clear. I do plan to check in with the client in a year to see if they used the voucher and have a discussion with them at that point. But Davids -- they can take a long walk off a short pier.


Well said, and you are so correct about people not understanding the "time value" of money by holding on to a guaranteed reservation for 8+ months and not having use of the points...or the money that could be generated from a sale.
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Old 09-16-2020, 03:53 AM   #757
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Originally Posted by lalimom View Post
you quite conveniently skip over the part that i offered them a full refund in April. Why ignore that? I gave them a chance to be made whole, Davids instead decided to roll the dice and in this case, lost. I also offered in July to refund the client directly. They said no, they had offered a voucher, client was happy. So much for your smirky response.

What did I give up when I rented my points in November under a "no refund" scenario? I gave up the option of selling my contract before the reservation date while maintaining the obligation to keep paying the annual fees associated with those points. So I got 70% of 14.50 per point less 8 for annual fees...clearing a little less than $3 per point. What do you think the (option) value of reserving points for 8 months should be? Zero? If so, you don't understand how option pricing works.

So, yes, I got my points back--all of which I paid $8ish in 2020 to maintain. And if it makes you happy, a large chunk of which will expire in November. Now, again, having offered to refund 100% in April and being turned down, my conscience is pretty clear. I do plan to check in with the client in a year to see if they used the voucher and have a discussion with them at that point. But Davids -- they can take a long walk off a short pier.
I get no joy out of anyone's misfortune (renter's, broker's, or owner's). It was a simple question to clarify your situation.
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Old 09-16-2020, 11:30 AM   #758
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Originally Posted by lalimom View Post
Your first sentence says a lot. The 'pontificating' part is offensive. I offered David's on April 9 a full refund of everything that had come to me (for a July reservation, that I had done the previous November) but told them that they needed to make a decision by April EOM so I could roll over. Davids said they weren't interested -- ok. But when Disney cancelled the reservation in July (something you could've seen happening in April), they wanted their money back OR I had the choice of re-renting taking on more liability than I would've before. Not happening and as far as I'm concerned, the 70% is the price for holding a reservation from November to July, esp since I gave them the option of cashing out completely in April. So read the threads before you start laying on 'pontificating'
I apologize if I offended you or anyone else. My complete sentence, which Iím sorry if it was too strong, was meant to point out that of the 100 or so entries I read in this thread making negative comments on Davidís service, 60% or more have not used his service or werenít caught up in this mess. Iím sorry you were and are unhappy about your results. I was happy with mine and wanted to share my experience.

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So, you kept the 70% and you kept your points?
This was also my experience. They never asked me for my 70% back and Disney put all points back into my account. Davidís only asked to re-rent my points. Which I was lucky they were able to do. Thus, Iím happy. And I agree that I should follow up with the renters who were given vouchers.

In a normal world, I would also be critical of them issuing vouchers. But nothing about the last 6 months has been normal for any business. My own small business lost 80% revenue and I had to pay out of personal pocket to keep my employees whole even with PPP $. Short of them taking out huge loans to cover both sides, I donít understand what else Davidís could have done. Now that demand seems to be slowly picking up, hopefully more sellers can be made whole.
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Old 09-16-2020, 11:45 AM   #759
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Short of them taking out huge loans to cover both sides, I donít understand what else Davidís could have done.
The company could have started out by NOT being so hypocritical. It asked owners to view the situation with their hearts (which, incidentally, a lot of owners were willing to do) while absolutely refusing to do the same thing itself. It started out with a self-protective, defensive, "screw the owner" attitude, and only after receiving bad press, decided to change its ways. Why don't you go over to the DIS and look at all of the threads bitching about the company's approach?

I'm glad it worked out for you. But that company has been removed from our sponsor list and will never be affiliated with this forum again. Why? Ethics, pure and simple.

It is interesting to me that as a new member, you chose this particular thread as a place to make your experiences known.
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Old 09-16-2020, 02:01 PM   #760
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....gave the rented a voucher. I assumed that was ok for them.

?
If you do some research you'll find that a lot weren't ok with it. Your particular renter may have been but even you state you are assuming and it very easily could be an incorrect assumption. David's did not give a choice to the renters - it was a voucher or so sorry but you've got nothing. When that's the choice you take the voucher and hope you'll be able to use it.

The other part about the brokers was the "guarantee" and "safe transaction" that they promised if you used them. Until suddenly they didn't. There were owners who were actively trying to refund and David's refused to allow that.
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