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Old 01-12-2020, 08:11 AM   #81
carolina_yankee
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There's a reasonable argument that "Walt's EPCOT" was a scam Walt created to bamboozle the Florida legislature into creating RCID. Perhaps because he wanted to build with less government interference. Or maybe because he really did want his own nuclear power plant.
I'd publish a SIMS city if it got me my own nuclear power plant.

I can see the argument both ways for Walt. It does seem to me he was pulling away from parks and films a bit and thinking of bigger things. I could see him trying for an EPCOT. I could also see him looking for the best way to get a toe-hold in Florida. The location was obviously chosen for year-round tourism, which speaks to entertainment . . .

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Old 01-12-2020, 08:27 AM   #82
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There's a reasonable argument that "Walt's EPCOT" was a scam Walt created to bamboozle the Florida legislature into creating RCID. Perhaps because he wanted to build with less government interference. Or maybe because he really did want his own nuclear power plant.

All of the above!



I welcome the Epcot changes. Some I like a lot and some I like a little.....but the park is evolving (has been) and should be a better park experience ince done.
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Old 01-13-2020, 11:38 AM   #83
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I welcome the Epcot changes. Some I like a lot and some I like a little.....but the park is evolving (has been) and should be a better park experience ince done.
I agree. I remember a similar conversation a few months ago, but I fall into the category of those who see that EPCOT was never what Walt reportedly envisioned (the actual functioning community), and that it hasn't been any reflection of a futuristic/imagination experience for many, many, years. I think the FW redo is beneficial and will hopefully give it some sense of identity and purpose that has been missing for quite some time.

My sense is that the greater consternation comes from those who are more 'purist' in their views of WS. On that, I guess it's a 'To each his/her own' type of thing. We wander WS, but really for little more than shopping and a couple rides. In many ways, it often feel as nothing more than a glorified international food and beverage court - especially during F&W (which is an increasingly over-crowded drunk fest in our experience). The only attractions in all of WDW we have not seen are some of the cultural presentations at WS. I know some love them, but it's just not what we go to Disney for. In all, we are really looking forward to about everything coming to Epcot and WDW as a whole!
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Old 01-13-2020, 02:05 PM   #84
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I agree. I remember a similar conversation a few months ago, but I fall into the category of those who see that EPCOT was never what Walt reportedly envisioned (the actual functioning community), and that it hasn't been any reflection of a futuristic/imagination experience for many, many, years. I think the FW redo is beneficial and will hopefully give it some sense of identity and purpose that has been missing for quite some time.

My sense is that the greater consternation comes from those who are more 'purist' in their views of WS.
So many in the Disney community are definitely purists and I think resistance to change is a genetic requirement for becoming a Disney fan!

As I've said, I look forward to what Epcot/EPCOT will become, but I still don't quite understand the purpose of the park. My problem is less with World Showcase and characters in appropriate countries (appropriately done) than with the makeover of FutureWorld.

Most of that is simply nostalgia for a park that was nearly perfectly designed at its peak, both architecturally and thematically. But nostalgia is simply an ache for the past and there is never a going back to the way things were.

So, I mourn what's gone but wait with interest what comes next. I'll evaluate it on it's own merits, not on what it replaces. But I still don't quite understand what EPCOT is going to be. I do think with the re-branding of FW into three neighborhoods, there is hope for something cohesive and unique. It will all depend on execution and a willingness to maintain it.

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Old 01-13-2020, 03:18 PM   #85
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Most of that is simply nostalgia for a park that was nearly perfectly designed at its peak, both architecturally and thematically. But nostalgia is simply an ache for the past and there is never a going back to the way things were.

So, I mourn what's gone but wait with interest what comes next. I'll evaluate it on it's own merits, not on what it replaces. But I still don't quite understand what EPCOT is going to be. I do think with the re-branding of FW into three neighborhoods, there is hope for something cohesive and unique. It will all depend on execution and a willingness to maintain it.

Dirk
Makes full sense. As we've discussed before, Epcot was already past this point when we started going. Thus, I have all of the anticipation of revitalization without nostalgia-driven sorrow of losing a beloved element of the past.
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Old 01-13-2020, 05:31 PM   #86
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I LOVED Coco. It was such a touching movie. Just wonderful. but I haven't watched it again. It's too emotionally draining.
I want my younger kids to be able to remember my Mom and Dad, whom they never really knew, and that movie inspired me to share more pictures, memories, etc with them, to keep their memories alive.
I loved the song, Remember Me. I hope they add it to anything they want to at Disney. It's a beautiful song. I was disappointed they didn't overlay the Mexican boat ride with Coco. It's so dated, and I think Coco scenes would've been a great addition.
Nooooooo. I actually don’t mind Coco music in the pavilion (movie is set in Mexico, vs fictional Arendale getting plopped into Norway.)

But, I have a Coco- type reason for not wanting Coco to take over the ride: Donald Duck and my dad. Donald Duck is a sailor born in the mid 1930’s, and so was my dad. My dad did the best Donald Duck impressions. My dad passed away in October 2012. Two months later we took my brother and 4 nieces & nephews to WDW (trip planned the year before). The very 1st thing I tried to take them to in the parks was meet & greet with Donald Duck in his frontier land outfit, only to find out it was gone. New Fantasyland had just opened up, and since it had “Donaldo”, no more Donald in fringe.

Did you know - there is not a single regular meet & greet with Donald in his regular costume in all of WDW resort? He’s Donaldo in MK, in a sombrero and poncho in Epcot, some sort of tourist in DHS, and in a safari outfit at AK. Some of those outfits are cute, but I want sailor Donald. He was in a MK stage show, and sometimes does pop-up appearances next to USA pavilion, but you can’t plan on meeting sailor Donald with any certainty.

So I ride in Mexico every trip (some trips multiple times) to see sailor Donald Duck and remember my dad.

OH! I just remembered that Disneyland Paris has Donald (in his real outfit) right between Main Street and the hub. We signed up for the Princess race weekend happening in May .... I’ll be able to get a picture! (This might be an even better incentive to stick to my eating plan than the actual race - I want a picture of me with Donald that I don’t mind having out.)

(Tried to both be on topic AND contribute to thread drift - how’d I do?)
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Old 01-13-2020, 10:18 PM   #87
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The only attractions in all of WDW we have not seen are some of the cultural presentations at WS. I know some love them, but it's just not what we go to Disney for.
Definitely a YMMV situation. Part of the purpose of WS is to introduce the people, culture and land of the home country, and the films do a great job of that. But if that's not ones thing, I can see not going.

Cheers.
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Old 01-14-2020, 11:34 AM   #88
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Definitely a YMMV situation. Part of the purpose of WS is to introduce the people, culture and land of the home country, and the films do a great job of that. But if that's not ones thing, I can see not going.

Cheers.
Absolutely. With kids still with us, and limited trips, we never have enough time to do all we want to do. Someday, when DW and I are doing no-kid trips, we may be more apt to check it out. For now, it just doesn't make the cut!
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