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Old 03-16-2020, 07:03 PM   #21
ziravan
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It could. However, not everyone has the luxury to move a travel date. Maybe this was it. Certainly trying to find alternate dates is choice #1. Failing that, I think cash is reasonable.

"I paid you for a reservation on these dates; you did not deliver that." Seems pretty cut-and-dried to me.

Cheers.
My contract has a force majeure clause that says if the reservation isn’t available due to circumstances beyond the control of the parties, the parties agree to equally share the loss.

I don’t think this is a FM situation because we can reschedule something but if renter was insistent that they couldn’t reschedule, in that case, I’d only owe them half back and I’d hold a renter unwilling to work through options to that agreement. I say that only to suggest that y’all consider adding that clause to future contracts:

“ Force Majeure: In the case of a catastrophic event beyond the control of the parties and/or Disney Vacation Club to fulfill the essentials of this contract, to provide the specified lodging during the specified times, both parties agree to equally share the loss of a non-recoverable reservation.”
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Old 03-16-2020, 07:07 PM   #22
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My contract has a force majeure clause that says if the reservation isnít available due to circumstances beyond the control of the parties, the parties agree to equally share the loss.

I donít think this is a FM situation because we can reschedule something but if renter was insistent that they couldnít reschedule, in that case, Iíd only owe them half back and Iíd hold a renter unwilling to work through options to that agreement. I say that only to suggest that yíall consider adding that clause to future contracts:
Except in this case, from my understanding, the returned points are being given extra privilege to expire later, or something like that. So the point owner is made whole that way. If my understanding is not correct, maybe different.

Cheers.
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Old 03-16-2020, 08:34 PM   #23
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Except in this case, from my understanding, the returned points are being given extra privilege to expire later, or something like that. So the point owner is made whole that way. If my understanding is not correct, maybe different.

Cheers.
DVC is waiving holding but they are enforcing banking rules.

Depending on the UY and status of the points, the owner could stand to take a huge loss. I go back to my point about travel insurance (personally, I think people are crazy not to purchase travel insurance for a no refund/no cancellation vacation accommodation, but that's just my .02. If someone want to take the risk of not having it, it is their money and their choice to take that risk). While I agree that an owner should do everything they can to help the renter re-book, I do not believe an owner should be in a position to lose money because a renter did not take the (IMO) obvious precaution of purchasing travel insurance. I know Disney closing resorts is rare - but what if someone going on the trip gets the flu, what if someone has an accident, do none of these people have elderly relatives for whom they would cancel a trip if said loved one ended up in the hospital. Travel Insurance is there for a reason. It's not that expensive if you buy it far enough out and only cover the non-refundable part of your trip.

Heck - people who DID buy Travel Insurance could easily double dip and get a Refund from the Insurance company because it's all over the news that Disney closed, and then get either a free vacay or a refund on the owner.

I truly am sympathetic to the renters, but I just have a pet peeve of people who think they don't need to bother taking clear, obvious steps to mitigate their own risks and protect their own interests then when something goes wrong, they expect to walk away with no consequences and expect someone else lose money because of their own lack of planning. I am not ok with that. I don't rent points, don't have any rented out now. I just don't agree that a renter's lack of common sense travel planning is suddenly an owner's problem and that the owner is expected to possibly lose hundred's of dollars in MF's and points that did not get used because the renter did not take the necessary step to protect their trip and now wants the owner to make up for that.

ETA: If any owner is willing to take the loss , or take the chance of the loss on soon to expire points- many kudos to them and I am sure that there will be owners who do that. I just take issue with an owner being *expected* to do that.
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Old 03-16-2020, 08:37 PM   #24
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I truly am sympathetic to the renters, but I just have a pet peeve of people who think they don't need to bother taking clear, obvious steps to mitigate their own risks and protect their own interests then when something goes wrong, they expect to walk away with no consequences and expect someone else lose money because of their own lack of planning.
All fair points but, I think that even people who were the type to plan for contingencies well would not have been prepared for the Zombie Apocalypse. This is unprecedented in the lifetime of anyone posting here, and likely our parents as well.

Let's just hope that reaccommodations work to everyone's satisfaction.

Cheers.
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Old 03-16-2020, 08:45 PM   #25
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IMO, refund is the way to go no matter what is in the contract. Fair enough for both parties.
Not fair to owners if points going to expire soon and they have booked those 11 month in advance.
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Old 03-17-2020, 05:39 AM   #26
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Heck - people who DID buy Travel Insurance could easily double dip and get a Refund from the Insurance company because it's all over the news that Disney closed, and then get either a free vacay or a refund on the owner.
We buy travel insurance every year and have been recommending it to people (clients) for many years. The costs are not that great vs what the loss of a trip would cost. Plus for traveling out of the country (mostly cruise travel) the coverage is even more invaluable in the case of covering emergency medical care, which is staggering.

Having the insurance for us has been proven invaluable over the years. It covered us when Robin had her car accident right before a big family Christmas trip. It covered us when Irma hit. It covered us when Mathew hit and ruined our oldest son wedding in WDW.
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Old 03-17-2020, 05:43 AM   #27
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Not fair to owners if points going to expire soon and they have booked those 11 month in advance.

This is where it gets tough. We are getting back over 700 points because of two trips we are losing during the shut-down. I think that most of those points are borrowed. So now I will have 700+ points to use by Sept 30th of this year. Its still too early to figure it all out, but I hate to be stuck with not being able to reuse those points.
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Old 03-17-2020, 06:41 AM   #28
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This is where it gets tough. We are getting back over 700 points because of two trips we are losing during the shut-down. I think that most of those points are borrowed. So now I will have 700+ points to use by Sept 30th of this year. Its still too early to figure it all out, but I hate to be stuck with not being able to reuse those points.
You might be in luck with your borrowed points. Isnít DVC allowing borrowed points to go back into the original UY? The people using banked points and people past the banking window are not getting any relief, but I thought I read that borrowers were getting some help.
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Old 03-17-2020, 06:45 AM   #29
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You might be in luck with your borrowed points. Isnít DVC allowing borrowed points to go back into the original UY? The people using banked points and people past the banking window are not getting any relief, but I thought I read that borrowers were getting some help.

I have heard that, but its not an official policy and Disney has not canceled thru Easter week yet. The trip we canceled at the end of March did not return the points to its original UY. We are calling today to see about those points and the Easter trip's points. We have been delaying since we know the phones are nuts with so many calling in to their call centers.
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Old 03-17-2020, 07:23 AM   #30
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I have heard that, but its not an official policy and Disney has not canceled thru Easter week yet. The trip we canceled at the end of March did not return the points to its original UY. We are calling today to see about those points and the Easter trip's points. We have been delaying since we know the phones are nuts with so many calling in to their call centers.
There have been a few reports of the online chat working well for people who canít get through on the phone. Might be worth a try. Best of luck!!!
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