Hijacking Deep Croaker

[Blue&Gold]

It's nice to have the Frog back...

I thought some of his DC info from another thread really deserves to be out here on its own...

DC feels that the KT announcement date will be the sales start date, or withing 2 weeks of the July 1 date.

There is a new DVC Manager (with actual marketing experience) so he is hopeful that all relevant info will also be released, but he is not certain, just hopeful.

They expect (plan) an 8 month sell-out of 296 units. DC also is optimistic but not certain it will be a 100% DVC resort, but that final decision has not be reached, yet alone announced.

Finally DC has seen internal documents confirming DVCs for all Deluxe resorts (ala Poly & GF) and possibly some moderates.

The DVC remains the fasted growing division of WDC, although if the KTs are not announced before fiscal year close, that may not hold true for Fiscal '07.

-Tony

An interesting point. Conventional DVCfan internet opinion has long been that due to Florida's timeshare laws, that a unit must be completed before being released into a sale inventory (confirmed by AKV selling patterns). If this is infact FL law, then I don't see how KT can be sold in 3-4 months, do you?


As to the last point, I believe "completed" might be too high a standard---believe it may be construed as a percentage of completion (Kidani Village, for instance and all of Jambo House since it was a conversion) not "complete." I think the scenario the regulation exists to prevent is the early Timeshare schemes where shares were sold and no building ever constructed.

Believe in the KT scenario we would be looking at something similar to current Kidani Village sales---you can buy, but you can't use until a point in the "near" future.

Question for the crowd---does the possibility of DVC at GF or Poly impact your thought process wrt KT? Other than monorail stop sequence and theme, does it matter?

[Daitcher]

Question for the crowd---does the possibility of DVC at GF or Poly impact your thought process wrt KT? Other than monorail stop sequence and theme, does it matter?



It would matter to me if I intedned on buying. I do not and in fact I will sell out completely very soon. BUT, if I was willing to buy in I'd much prefer GF or the Poly to CRV(KT). Amenities/decor matter to our famliy and we greatly prefer the offerings at the Poly and GF to the CR.

So if I was in the market, yes, it would matter and I'd wait.


DAVE

[bigbahamadada]

We would be very, very interested in a DVC at the Poly. But the potential for that won't impact our decision whether to add on at KT. We've already have decided it's not for us. For all its many merits, KT isn't the kind of hotel experience we're looking for at WDW. Give us VWL and AKV.

If all three (KT, Poly and GF) were for sale at the same time, my order of preference for purchase would be Poly, GF and KT.

[OttawaWendy]

I don't think they will be for sale at the same time, because that's just internal competition. Also it is a big outlay of cash (they foot these costs until they can sell), and it is easier to having rolling build/sell sequences so they only have a reasonable amount of self-financed construction going on at once. On the other hand, DVC is getting bigger all the time, and they now do have more than one build occuring at once, so that pattern may get progressively bigger.

I won't buy an add-on, at least not in the near or medium future, but just for interest, I would say that my preference for add-on would be Poly, GF, Contemporary. Having said that, I'm a big fan of theming, and I really don't like the Contemporary or GF, so I'd be more likely to buy an add-on from VWL, OKW, AKV or BCV before either of those.

Dave, why are you planning to sell out?

[Daitcher]

Dave, why are you planning to sell out?


To put my reasons into context please keep in mind that we've been owners since 1992. We certainly had a love affair with the mouse over that time. WDW was always such a magical place for us. It just gave us a feeling we couldn't describe. It just was a special place.

We had accumulated 1250 or so points and we had a plan to spend a month or more at WDW in the winters. After a frustrating go round with DVC and DVC legal regarding renting of points, which I won't detail, we sold of some of our contracts leaving us with one 350 point contract at SSR. We thought we would miss the points but you know what, we do not. I certainly don't miss the annual dues statements, LOL.

We've seen changes that have impacted our feelings for WDW/DVC. We have also changed over those years as well. We now desire a higher level of service/luxury. WDW isn't providing that for us any longer. We have lost that magical feeling we once had. We've watched the dining erode at WDW thanks to the DDP, we've seen the parks go from spotless to dirty restrooms/streets, we've seen a significant decline in the upkeep of DVC properties and regularly encounter problems with our room, we've asked for "To Go" orders to eat in room with our young son instaed of dragging him out to a sit down dinner and been told, NO thanks to the DDP, we've seen less than magical shift towards a sales focus with DVC rather than keeping the membership happy, we find the parks tired and unimaginative, etc. We have just lost that feeling for whatever reason. We actaully go one year to Disney parks and then the following year we stay at DVC and do Universal/Seaworld.

Also, I have serious concerns about the value of DVC going forward. I want to get out when prices are still stable. Who knows what the future holds but now I can get out without losing my shirt. Why should I own? IF we desire a trip there are tons of good choices in Orlando. Heck, I'll rent a three bedroom house with a pool and invite friends, who knows. I can rent points from a reliable owner. I can stay at the Ritz or Four Seasons, etc. Why should I let DVC hold my $25,000 PLUS pay them $120 a month in dues? I shouldn't and I won't.

I hope this answers it. It is a feeling we have coupled with a change in our desires when we travel. We never intended DVC as a long term thing anyway. We always viewed it as a use and dump program so we are now doing that. 16 years is a long time and I guess it has run it's course.



DAVE

[kdzgon]

It's nice to have the Frog back...

...

Question for the crowd---does the possibility of DVC at GF or Poly impact your thought process wrt KT? Other than monorail stop sequence and theme, does it matter?

I concur with the first statement - as to the second, if I were absolutely positive the Poly & GF were coming on line within say 2 yrs or so, yes, I would wait. I don't need so many points that I wold want to buy at all three places, and I don't want to get in to the position of worrying about selling points to buy elsewhere.

BUT, since I don't know that for sure and I will have 6 grandchildren 5 or younger before the end of the year, I'll be "mooing" my way to that proverbial slaughter (to use the metaphor of another poster..)

If indeed there are more plans in the works, I'd imagine it will mitigate the KT (KTV?) premium somewhat, no?

[Daitcher]

I concur with the first statement - as to the second, if I were absolutely positive the Poly & GF were coming on line within say 2 yrs or so, yes, I would wait. I don't need so many points that I wold want to buy at all three places, and I don't want to get in to the position of worrying about selling points to buy elsewhere.

BUT, since I don't know that for sure and I will have 6 grandchildren 5 or younger before the end of the year, I'll be "mooing" my way to that proverbial slaughter (to use the metaphor of another poster..)

If indeed there are more plans in the works, I'd imagine it will mitigate the KT (KTV?) premium somewhat, no?



This makes total sense. One thing I'd throw out there is that they are expecting an 8 month sell out of KT. Even a year is nothing and I wouldn't doubt it so what does that leave them on site, AKV???? That hasn't exactly beeen a big hit so it wouldn't surprise me at all to see a Gf or Poly DVC be online in 2-3 years.


DAVE

[Blue&Gold]

Even a year is nothing and I wouldn't doubt it so what does that leave them on site, AKV???? That hasn't exactly beeen a big hit so it wouldn't surprise me at all to see a Gf or Poly DVC be online in 2-3 years.

DAVE

Wouldn't the fact that they are already selling Kidani Village imply that they've sold out all of Jambo House, or roughly 30+% of AKV in less than a year? I think SSR has been on sale for 4 or 5 years, hasn't it? (I know it's bigger---but it's not proportionally that much bigger...)

[gblast123]

This makes total sense. One thing I'd throw out there is that they are expecting an 8 month sell out of KT. Even a year is nothing and I wouldn't doubt it so what does that leave them on site, AKV???? That hasn't exactly beeen a big hit so it wouldn't surprise me at all to see a Gf or Poly DVC be online in 2-3 years.


DAVE


I think that you may be mis-interpreting some of DC statements. The 8 month sellout will be for Phase I. Apparently there will be a Phase II, and Phase III in the works...now whether the Poly and GF are Phase II or Phase III is another question, but if the resort that may not be named is as popular as everyone is projecting, they will not stop when the first Phase is sold out...that is what they did with Saratoga....kept on building and building and building and giving incentive points and incentive points....

Must have been someone with no sales experience and an MBA from Harvard that came up with that brilliant idea:sick:

There is a lot of internal conflict within Disney between DVC and the Hotel people. Hotel group doesn't want anything like DVC treading on their turf. They want to remain the ultra premium Monorail hotels. They don't like the idea of a lot of DVC riff raff mixing with their upscale, high paying clients.:fresh:

The DVC people have pointed out several things...like after 911 when nobody was coming to the parks...DVC members kept on going..buying tickets...buying meals...and keeping the post 911 downturn from turning into a disaster.

They expect that if there is a severe economic downturn, that DVC will continue the pattern... Hotels will suffer as discretionary spending falls, but DVC continues to remain full...buying tickets...meals...backstage tours...etc.

I think that DVC will eventually win out...but Disney grows by evolution...they do not make radical changes, even when there is a lot of pressure to do so.

Did I mention that DVC is one of the most lucrative divisions in Disney? They make money several ways...from the initial sales, from the astronomical maintanence fees, from the Breakage ( people who forget to use or have their points expire which DVC inherits), from the points that people trade in for cruises (they use these points to rent out the DVC rooms at full rack rate...guess how many $$$ per point they get!!), etc.

We are leaving out revenue from the park tickets, meals, souveniers, etc that the DVC members generate.

The Hotel people argue that every sale of DVC is someone they are losing for Hotel stays for the next 50 years. Considering the rapid escalation of hotel room fees over the past several years, they are estimating that each DVC sale results in substantial loss for them over the years...which is true.

That has been one of the reasons that DVC didn't expand before on the Monorail.

Finally, everyone looked at the bottom line and someone said let us try the resort which may not be named. To some degree, the success of the resort and the loss of hotel revenue will be looked at very closely.

Didn't anybody wonder about why the ask for the names of everyone and the primary guest address and tel. number? By looking up the name and address in the computer, they can bring up an entire history of stays at disney, and see what you bought and how much you spent.

Think about the Magic room Key....it tracks all your purchases and associates it with where you stay, etc.

Any DVC sales person can call up your name and address and see how many hotel stays you are at, how much you spent, etc. I know this because one of my renters went on a tour and told me that they had every room stay, etc. and utilized it as a selling point of how much they would save if they bought DVC points.

After I heard about that, I make sure that I put nothing on the room key unless I have to.

Getting back to the OP, the expected sell out is for Phase I...

David

[Blue&Gold]

Getting back to the OP, the expected sell out is for Phase I...


Something our friend the Frog might want to check with DC... Certainly is a difference between an 8 month sell-out of 75 units (as Phase I is reported to contain in the Orlando Sentinel article and related paperwork) and one of 296 units.

Might be a case of conflicting informants!

[gblast123]

Something our friend the Frog might want to check with DC... Certainly is a difference between an 8 month sell-out of 75 units (as Phase I is reported to contain in the Orlando Sentinel article and related paperwork) and one of 296 units.

Might be a case of conflicting informants!

It's not really conflicting information. It is more a matter of interpreting the information which is available...which is not a lot.

Also, how do you define "selling out" of a resort. Think about Saratoga..it was "selling out"...then all of a sudden, a new phase or expansion was announced.

Probably we are both correct, but from different viewpoints.

David

[Daitcher]

Wouldn't the fact that they are already selling Kidani Village imply that they've sold out all of Jambo House, or roughly 30+% of AKV in less than a year? I think SSR has been on sale for 4 or 5 years, hasn't it? (I know it's bigger---but it's not proportionally that much bigger...)



I'm not sure what percentage of AKV Jambo House is but I think it is far less than 30%. I'd guess maybe 15% but maybe somebody knows for sure. SSR has been selling for roughly 6 years at this point.

You and Gblast (David) bring up a good point. I may have misinterpreted the DC's info. 8 months sounds awful fast for the entire place but phase 1 would be more than believable.


DAVE

[DVC Mike]

I'm not sure what percentage of AKV Jambo House is but I think it is far less than 30%. I'd guess maybe 15% but maybe somebody knows for sure. SSR has been selling for roughly 6 years at this point.



Jambo House has 134 Units / 216 max available rooms, while Kidani Village will have 324 Units / 492 max available rooms, for a total of 458 Units / 708 max available rooms.

So Jambo House is around 30% of AKV.

[TW1]

Think about the Magic room Key....it tracks all your purchases and associates it with where you stay, etc.

After I heard about that, I make sure that I put nothing on the room key unless I have to.

David, hopefully this isn't news for anyone. In fact, unless you are using cash, ALL your purchases are tracked back to you eventually, room key or not.:innocent:

Not only our purchases, but every phone call to our guide, to MS, to Dining, to book our Illumination cruise, every time we log on to the website, every time we begin an online purchase and abandon the process mid stream, and so much more, is tracked, coded, studied and used to alter marketing strategies, pricing, events, etc.

Everytime we call to ask if there's a table at a given restaurant at a given time, it is recorded and studied to determine potential sales, lost sales, opportunities for future sales, etc. And be sure it is not a Disney thing. It is done, or should be done, by every successful company and it is easy and cheap to do. It is how Disney, and Comcast, and Dunkin Donuts, and Hyatt, and Dell, and Chrysler, and Netflix, and any other successful firm must operate.

So, yes, the hotel folks are seriously looking at the DVC'ers habits, all of our spending patterns, what excites us and what bores us, what we feel we aren't getting and what we are offered that we aren't using and trying to keep DVC from cannibalizing the hotel trade. What has helped in a very big way is the weak dollar and all those beautiful foreign visitors.


OK, sorry to hijack the DC thread. And yes, it is nice to see Tony back among the living. It was almost time for a "Where's Greenban" thread!

[Bacala]

If the plans were definite regarding GF or Poly, I would certainly hold off of KTV, at least my preference would be GF.

However, my feeling is that KTV will be very popular (not exactly an original thought, I know) and if I buy in at KTV and GF comes online 2 to4 years later, I would easily be able to sell KTV without much of a price reduction, if any, in order to buy GF. There is an obvious cost to doing this, i.e., 4 years of mf and I am sure the prices will go up, but I am guessing it will probably be close to the paper cost of the vacations I will take in those 4 years. Either way, I think I would fair better in this hypothetical transaction than I will in the soon to be real transaction of selling my SS points for KTV.

With respect to the sales of KTV as soon as it is announced, I would imagine that there would still be a members only purchase window in the beginning, but it sounds like that would be a very truncated time period.

[Daitcher]

Jambo House has 134 Units / 216 max available rooms, while Kidani Village will have 324 Units / 492 max available rooms, for a total of 458 Units / 708 max available rooms.

So Jambo House is around 30% of AKV.



Thanks for the clarification on that Mike. I actually had you in mind when I posted that. I knew you'd have the numbers.:thumbsup: I stand corrected. 30% of AKV has apparently been sold, more at this point.


DAVE

[TW1]

Question for the crowd---does the possibility of DVC at GF or Poly impact your thought process wrt KT? Other than monorail stop sequence and theme, does it matter?

Monorail helps, but in the end it doesn't matter.

I think back to my DVC purchase and I remember that it was a no-brainer.

I just took the kids to WDW, stayed at a moderate value resort, and couldn’t wait to get back. After two or three of these trips I finally said to myself “why am I paying almost $1,500 just for my room? There must be a better way.”

As long as there are WDW visitors that fit that profile there will be DVC sales.

And we all know there are tens of thousands of visitors that fit this profile every day of every year. There were yesterday, there will be today and there will be ten years from today.

Plus, the whole idea of being a Member of something, of anything, is sexy to most of us. “Me, little ole’ me, can be a Member of the House of Mouse? I’m tingly all over just thinking about it!"

And I can save money?!? And it’s real estate! Sweeeeeeeeeeeeeet! I can hardly afford my current home, but I can easily afford just $175 a month for ten years to “own a villa in Walt Disney World.”

Monorail or not, it's a no-brainer for most folks. I've said it before, DVC has barely scratched the surface of its potential. There will be 1 million members someday. I'd bet a Christmas week GV on it.

[OttawaWendy]

To put my reasons into context please keep in mind that we've been owners since 1992. We certainly had a love affair with the mouse over that time. WDW was always such a magical place for us. It just gave us a feeling we couldn't describe. It just was a special place.
...
We never intended DVC as a long term thing anyway. We always viewed it as a use and dump program so we are now doing that. 16 years is a long time and I guess it has run it's course.



DAVE

Thanks Dave. It is interesting to hear your perspective.

[OttawaWendy]

There is a lot of internal conflict within Disney between DVC and the Hotel people. Hotel group doesn't want anything like DVC treading on their turf. They want to remain the ultra premium Monorail hotels. They don't like the idea of a lot of DVC riff raff mixing with their upscale, high paying clients.:fresh:

Well, I'm part of the riff raff, because I just couldn't justify spending the money on a deluxe resort. I stayed in Values, and once in a Moderate. This September, when I am staying for cash to get free dining, we are in a Value. So maybe this part is true - maybe we do bring down the "atmosphere" at the deluxe hotels.

Did I mention that DVC is one of the most lucrative divisions in Disney? They make money several ways...from the initial sales, from the astronomical maintanence fees, from the Breakage ( people who forget to use or have their points expire which DVC inherits), from the points that people trade in for cruises (they use these points to rent out the DVC rooms at full rack rate...guess how many $$$ per point they get!!), etc.

I buy all of this except the maintenance fees. When I look at sites like this: http://www.mouseowners.com/SSRBudget2006.html, then it appears to me that our maintenance fees are a break-even activity, at least on first blush. Of course, what they pay for these services probably includes a profit component to each division (for the external things like lawyers and the internal things like transportation). I had always thought DVC was essentially condominium corporation like, and the budget was essentially break-even. What am I missing?

The Hotel people argue that every sale of DVC is someone they are losing for Hotel stays for the next 50 years. Considering the rapid escalation of hotel room fees over the past several years, they are estimating that each DVC sale results in substantial loss for them over the years...which is true.

David

Not sure I agree with this, which seems like a simplistic analysis. Of course, if you assume that every DVC member would take the identical vacations, but buying the reservation for cash through CRO, Disney would make more money without DVC. (Which is just another way of saying that DVC saves us money over equivalent vacations). But how many of us would stay in these kinds of accommodations as frequently as we do, if we were paying cash? I can't be the only one who goes to Disney more frequently, and stays in higher level accommodations, than I otherwise would because I'm a DVC member.

[glypnirsgirl]

I can't be the only one who goes to Disney more frequently, and stays in higher level accommodations, than I otherwise would because I'm a DVC member.

:iagree: Like you, I sometimes still pay cash for going to WDW. But, I go much more frequently as a DVC member than I ever did on cash. I paid the high price to be on the monorail for convenience not for "luxury" - I did not want to mess with getting a car and with a small child the monorail just worked better in the beginning.

DH and I are making 6 trips (4 of them just the two of us) in a 16 month period. 3 of the trips are for a full week, 3 of them for 4 days. We paid cash for the early December trip because we could not find availability using points. We opted for POR because that was what was available.

There is no way in the world that we would pay for 6 trips to WDW without DVC.

[Daitcher]

There is a lot of internal conflict within Disney between DVC and the Hotel people. Hotel group doesn't want anything like DVC treading on their turf. They want to remain the ultra premium Monorail hotels. They don't like the idea of a lot of DVC riff raff mixing with their upscale, high paying clients.:fresh:



David,

Are those your words or someone elses?

The reason I ask is that I have speculated and posted years ago that DVC members are viewed as the black sheep at WDW. They are viewed this way by CM's that see us as whining complaining, demanding losers. We are also viewed as lower class by guests paying cash to stay the Deluxe Resorts and to some degree the Mods. They think "GREAT, another dumb Timeshare owner, who got duped into a purchase."

I'm curious where this came from because I've always gotten the feelings I posted above and it would be validating to hear those sentiments from an insider at WDW.


DAVE

[greenban]

Just an offical welcome to the many DISboard viewers reading over here at MOs.

Why not register and join the friendliest DVC forum on the web!

-Tony

[carolina_yankee]

Well, I'm part of the riff raff, because I just couldn't justify spending the money on a deluxe resort. I stayed in Values, and once in a Moderate. This September, when I am staying for cash to get free dining, we are in a Value. So maybe this part is true - maybe we do bring down the "atmosphere" at the deluxe hotels.
Fellow riff-raff. But I pose well. :) I'll spend enough to stay at AKL or VWL, but not higher.

I buy all of this except the maintenance fees. When I look at sites like this: http://www.mouseowners.com/SSRBudget2006.html, then it appears to me that our maintenance fees are a break-even activity, at least on first blush. Of course, what they pay for these services probably includes a profit component to each division (for the external things like lawyers and the internal things like transportation). I had always thought DVC was essentially condominium corporation like, and the budget was essentially break-even. What am I missing?

There's a profit component built into the management fee. The more efficiently they can administer the program, the more money they make. I think the management is a set percentage of dues income.

However, I wondered about the original comment as well. I think you're right - they're just passing on the other costs to us (goods and services). I don't think they can even charge a profit for use of transportation and such (except for over-estimating the cost of the service).

[aReallyBadEgg]

Just an offical welcome to the many DISboard viewers reading over here at MOs.

Why not register and join the friendliest DVC forum on the web!

-Tony

You must be one bad frog.

:lmbo:

[gblast123]

Just an offical welcome to the many DISboard viewers reading over here at MOs.

Why not register and join the friendliest DVC forum on the web!

-Tony
:iagree: And I have officially be banned from dis for 1 month!!!:doublejum

Dis has become an autocratic cesspool of endless rules and behavioral strictures, designed to eliminate debate and prevent dissemination of useful information.

For example, I posted the same thread concerning the resort that shall not be named in Dis...it was moved from the regular section to the backwater portion of the board...where it eventually died a natural death.

I decided that Dis can remain uninformed...their policies will eventually lead to its demise.

Quite frankly, many Dis members are vehemently anti-rental...and they seem to join here to try spread their nonsense... I actually enjoy being able to respond here to some of their ridiculous postings without fear that I will get "10 point infractions", etc.

I have offered to contribute financially to MO, and think that it is an open and wonderful forum for everyone...even the microcephalics that post on Dis...so I welcome them also.

David

[cincinmouse]

:Dis has become an autocratic cesspool of endless rules and behavioral strictures, designed to eliminate debate and prevent dissemination of useful information.

For example, I posted the same thread concerning the resort that shall not be named in Dis...it was moved from the regular section to the backwater portion of the board...where it eventually died a natural death.

I decided that Dis can remain uninformed...their policies will eventually lead to its demise.

even the microcephalics that post on Dis...so I welcome them also.

David

Since I recently joined DVC earlier this year I do look at both MO and that ***** other board daily. After following both boards for several months i can say there is a lot of "noise" on Dis*** I do like the free spirited debate that occurs on MO and the discussion that are not just about what resort you can get at 7 months but current issues and the future of DVC like this thread.

Have any of you long time members (notice greenban I did not say older) thought of trying to get on the DVC board??? Is that even possible. :idontgeti You guys could really shake things up for the better.

[gblast123]

That is one of the reasons that DVC highly restricts the number of points you can own...

Personally, my proxie goes to Greenbanned anytime he decides to run!!

It is something I think I spoke to Tony about some time ago... and I think that it is a great idea.

It will take some degree of organization but I am willing to volunteer to help organize.

I have no interest in running for myself, but Greenbanned, Daitcher and a few others.... you have my support.

DAvid

[gblast123]

David,

Are those your words or someone elses?

The reason I ask is that I have speculated and posted years ago that DVC members are viewed as the black sheep at WDW. They are viewed this way by CM's that see us as whining complaining, demanding losers. We are also viewed as lower class by guests paying cash to stay the Deluxe Resorts and to some degree the Mods. They think "GREAT, another dumb Timeshare owner, who got duped into a purchase."

I'm curious where this came from because I've always gotten the feelings I posted above and it would be validating to hear those sentiments from an insider at WDW.


DAVE

Well, there is some of my own opinions there, but the tension between the Hotel group and the DVC group is real, and DVC treads upon the Hotel groups "turf" so to speak.

The feeling that DVC people are less desireable is based in part upon spending habits.. DVC people are, in my view. a smarter group that are good bargain hunters, as a result, they tend to spend less money. Also, they have more of a bone to pick as a result of their considerable investment...so they are going to be more vocal.

The Hotel group is part of the old guard that didn't want to "go into the low end" of timeshare sales and felt that it dimished the Disney image... Of course, when the OKW grand experiment succeeded, and especially when, after 911 - the Hotels were abandoned... the DVC'ers remained loyal and came... effectively bailing out a disasterous year.

I tend to speak to a lot of different people, and I cannot disclose the sources... but I think that deep croaker is not one of them... but you can be assured that the above is fairly accurate.

Currently the DVC division is the most profitable.. however, it can only remain so as long as new resorts keep on going up... At some point, there will be a saturation level, then watch prices plummet. We are far from that point for now. But that day will arrive, I am sure. As to when.... I don't have a crystal ball for now.

DVC cannot expand much farther in WDW for now... as it is going to have more and more of an impact upon Hotels and because of owners who rent their points. So there will be some pause after the unnamed resort is full.

One of the reasons for Hawaii and other locations are that there is no competition with the WDW hotel group, although there is a hotel component in Hawaii.

Anyway, more to come later.

David

[greenban]

Since I recently joined DVC earlier this year I do look at both MO and that ***** other board daily. After following both boards for several months i can say there is a lot of "noise" on Dis*** I do like the free spirited debate that occurs on MO and the discussion that are not just about what resort you can get at 7 months but current issues and the future of DVC like this thread.

Have any of you long time members (notice greenban I did not say older) thought of trying to get on the DVC board??? Is that even possible. :idontgeti You guys could really shake things up for the better.

I truely appreciate the age sensitive nature of your post, especially for those of us who are youth-depleted ;)

I believe the board postions are all appointed by DVD to employees, but some of our POS experts (Oh Mike?????) will know for sure.

However, let me say, if nominated I will run, and if elected I will serve!

I thank you cincinmouse for the high compliment, and David you can be my campaign manager in a heartbeat.

-Tony

PS I was DIStressed to see my name (as a ban-nee) can no longer be spoken over DER in the DVC forums. Who knew so many people had amphibiphobia?!? :faint:

[greenban]

I truely appreciate the age sensitive nature of your post, especially for those of us who are youth-depleted ;)

I believe the board postions are all appointed by DVD to employees, but some of our POS experts (Oh Mike?????) will know for sure.

However, let me say, if nominated I will run, and if elected I will serve!

I thank you cincinmouse for the high compliment, and David you can be my campaign manager in a heartbeat.

-Tony

PS I was DIStressed to see my name (as a ban-nee) can no longer be spoken over DER in the DVC forums. Who knew so many people had amphibiphobia?!? :faint:

And FWIW, I too have heard about the Hotel group's 'issues' with DVD/DVC.... David's take is spot on IMHO.

And much as I found idiot a little stong, using the term microcephalic to label many of the fine, mature and informed DISposters is somewhat insulting...........

...

to microcephalics! Kidding, Kidding, as usual I jest!

[gblast123]

And FWIW, I too have heard about the Hotel group's 'issues' with DVD/DVC.... David's take is spot on IMHO.

And much as I found idiot a little stong, using the term microcephalic to label many of the fine, mature and informed DISposters is somewhat insulting...........

...

to microcephalics! Kidding, Kidding, as usual I jest!

TOO, TOO FUNNNNNNNY!:hahahaha:

[Daitcher]

Well, there is some of my own opinions there, but the tension between the Hotel group and the DVC group is real, and DVC treads upon the Hotel groups "turf" so to speak.

The feeling that DVC people are less desireable is based in part upon spending habits.. DVC people are, in my view. a smarter group that are good bargain hunters, as a result, they tend to spend less money. Also, they have more of a bone to pick as a result of their considerable investment...so they are going to be more vocal.

The Hotel group is part of the old guard that didn't want to "go into the low end" of timeshare sales and felt that it dimished the Disney image... Of course, when the OKW grand experiment succeeded, and especially when, after 911 - the Hotels were abandoned... the DVC'ers remained loyal and came... effectively bailing out a disasterous year.

I tend to speak to a lot of different people, and I cannot disclose the sources... but I think that deep croaker is not one of them... but you can be assured that the above is fairly accurate.

Currently the DVC division is the most profitable.. however, it can only remain so as long as new resorts keep on going up... At some point, there will be a saturation level, then watch prices plummet. We are far from that point for now. But that day will arrive, I am sure. As to when.... I don't have a crystal ball for now.

DVC cannot expand much farther in WDW for now... as it is going to have more and more of an impact upon Hotels and because of owners who rent their points. So there will be some pause after the unnamed resort is full.

One of the reasons for Hawaii and other locations are that there is no competition with the WDW hotel group, although there is a hotel component in Hawaii.

Anyway, more to come later.

David



Thanks.

It makes total sense to me.:teacher:


DAVE

[tomandrobin]

DVC cannot expand much farther in WDW for now... as it is going to have more and more of an impact upon Hotels and because of owners who rent their points. So there will be some pause after the unnamed resort is full.

One of the reasons for Hawaii and other locations are that there is no competition with the WDW hotel group, although there is a hotel component in Hawaii.


I agree with the first part of this, that after KT there may not be any more WDW DVC resorts for a time period. I think the push will be for more off site sales. Building at Poly or GF will detract from the off site sales. Also, why sell the Eagle Pines property?

Who is going to run the Off-site hotel? Will this be a new division in the hotel group? Running a "park" resort is totally different then a stand alone facility. Will this be labeled part of that Blue Sky push of resorts.?

[lenshanem]

We want KT to be walking distance to the MK, on the monorail and views of the MK. I've personally never been crazy about the Contemporary and it is one of the last few WDW resorts I've yet to stay at.

If the Poly is offered I would take that over KT for sure. I love the theming there. Between KT and GF? That would be a tough call, GF theming is better, but there probably won't be as many MK views and you can't walk to the MK, although it is certainly a quick monorail ride away.

I think we'll add on at KT and then if the Poly comes along down the line we'll sell one of our contracts. We currently have BCV and VWL. As much as I love VWL, I will never sell our BCV unless we needed to for financial reasons.



Now here is my question - where in the world would they add a DVC at the Poly and the GF?!? I thought this has been discussed before and the general thought was there was no room. I'm assuming they would have to convert some existing buildings? I guess at the GF it could be built next to the parking across the street, but at the Poly?!?

Also, at 296 units where does that place KT in the WDW resorts as far as size? I like having the smaller resorts.

[greenban]

Talk about paranoia!!!

On a thread at DAT BORED place, someone mentioned KT Rumors from Deep Croaker at MOs. Another posted where is the other board (MOs)? An answering post of "Google Deep Croaker DVC will get you there" has now been deleted!

Come on, even angry Drawfs with small dental picks can't really suggest that a post containing Googling Instructions violates DER posting guidelines!

Too Too Funny!


Derailed by a dwarven Dentist...........

-Tony

[Carol]

You all are too funny!

I enjoy reading the posts on this board, esp the ones about future plans and rumors.

But I have to wonder why you all seem to spend so much time on the OTHER place if it's so awful?????? I don't get all the inside jokes so they mostly just sound like sour grapes to me.

Just another perspective.

[carolina_yankee]

You all are too funny!

I enjoy reading the posts on this board, esp the ones about future plans and rumors.

But I have to wonder why you all seem to spend so much time on the OTHER place if it's so awful?????? I don't get all the inside jokes so they mostly just sound like sour grapes to me.

Just another perspective.

Carol - this board started because the founding members felt alienated from DIS. A couple were even banned, but the site owner and first guides just left on their own. I came in after the fact, so I don't have any issues one way or the other, except to marvel at small-mindedness and paranoia. I've been given an infraction over there for quoting SOMEONE ELSE who mentioned MO. It's like driving past an accident - you don't want to look, but sometimes you can't help yourself.

Anyway - MO is moving on to 7500 members soon and I'm sure will hit 10,000 before we much older than 3. Our membership so far doubles every year. Nothing says revenge like success - so I agree - it's nice to keep things positive. Still - sometimes we like to slow down and look at that train wreck . . .

Dirk

[DVC Mike]

I believe the board postions are all appointed by DVD to employees, but some of our POS experts (Oh Mike?????) will know for sure.

However, let me say, if nominated I will run, and if elected I will serve!


Basically, all of us have designated DVD as the Voting Representative for the unit we own an interest in. The only way to remove DVD as the Voting Representative for a particular unit is for 60% of the DVC members who hold an ownership interest in a particular unit to concur in writing that DVD should be removed as that unit's Voting Representative. The owners of that unit must elect one of their own to serve as the new Voting Representative.

The rules make it very unlikely that DVC can be removed. They would have to walk away from the association on their own.

[lenshanem]

That is so funny. Really, some people over there need to get a life. Seriously. I really don't go over to the DVC boards over there anymore, just the WISH board there.

OK, I'm bumping my previous questions, cause I'm really curious. Ya, know like Alice. ;)

Now here is my question - where in the world would they add a DVC at the Poly and the GF?!? I thought this has been discussed before and the general thought was there was no room. I'm assuming they would have to convert some existing buildings? I guess at the GF it could be built next to the parking across the street, but at the Poly?!?

Also, at 296 units where does that place KT in the WDW resorts as far as size? I like having the smaller resorts.

[tomandrobin]

Now here is my question - where in the world would they add a DVC at the Poly and the GF?!? I thought this has been discussed before and the general thought was there was no room. I'm assuming they would have to convert some existing buildings? I guess at the GF it could be built next to the parking across the street, but at the Poly?!?

Also, at 296 units where does that place KT in the WDW resorts as far as size? I like having the smaller resorts.

At this time, I think its undetermined where DVC units would go in at those locations. At AKV, DVC took over a floor and added a new resort. At Contemporary, they tore down a hotel section and built a new tower. There certainly doesn't seem to much room to build anything new at either resort, without taking a building out first.

As for the second question, I don't think we know the exact room configurations yet to determine its capacity. I am going to guess it will fall between BWV (383) and BCV (208) in size. For reference AKV will have 458 units, OKW 531, SSR 828, VWL 136, VB 172 and HHI 102. Hawaii is projected to have 400 units and California 50 units.

[Carol]

Carol - this board started because the founding members felt alienated from DIS. A couple were even banned, but the site owner and first guides just left on their own. I came in after the fact, so I don't have any issues one way or the other, except to marvel at small-mindedness and paranoia. I've been given an infraction over there for quoting SOMEONE ELSE who mentioned MO. It's like driving past an accident - you don't want to look, but sometimes you can't help yourself.

Anyway - MO is moving on to 7500 members soon and I'm sure will hit 10,000 before we much older than 3. Our membership so far doubles every year. Nothing says revenge like success - so I agree - it's nice to keep things positive. Still - sometimes we like to slow down and look at that train wreck . . .

DirkThanks for the history. Congrats on the 7500 members!

[Blue&Gold]

Hawaii is projected to have 400 units and California 50 units.

I don't think they've committed to how many of 400 in Hawaii will be DVC... But I could be mis-remembering.

[greenban]

You all are too funny!

I enjoy reading the posts on this board, esp the ones about future plans and rumors.

But I have to wonder why you all seem to spend so much time on the OTHER place if it's so awful?????? I don't get all the inside jokes so they mostly just sound like sour grapes to me.

Just another perspective.

Not sour grapes, I would go back in a minute if they'd let me. But since WMD would have to admit why he actually banned me, that'll never happen.

Why do I still go there to read? Great info and a tremendous bunch of WDW and DVC fans, not all of whom post here (yet).

I will however point out humor and hypocracy (sp?) where ever I (think) I see it!

Although WMD is such an easy target (Hipocracy (sp?)) wise, that it really isn't a challenge.

But Dean, JimC, Dianeschlidt, HBC and the many other seniors are worth the lurk!

And if IRC, that other place stared out MouseOwners when many of the DVC regulars started posting here, and also, undr the current infraction rules, you daring to accuse me of having sour grapes, would probably be viewed as an attack and deleted. Of course it is not, and free speech and criticism is welcome and supported here, which sets MOs apart, and IMO ahead of THAT other BORED!

-Tony

[tomandrobin]

I don't think they've committed to how many of 400 in Hawaii will be DVC... But I could be mis-remembering.

The proposed resort is to have over 800 rooms, with about 400 of them being DVC rooms.

[Blue&Gold]

The proposed resort is to have over 800 rooms, with about 400 of them being DVC rooms.

Ahhh...

[OttawaWendy]

Now here is my question - where in the world would they add a DVC at the Poly and the GF?!? I thought this has been discussed before and the general thought was there was no room. I'm assuming they would have to convert some existing buildings? I guess at the GF it could be built next to the parking across the street, but at the Poly?!?

Well, a conversion (as per the Jambo units at AKL/AKV) is a possibility, isn't it. I'm not sure the percentage of time that GF and the Poly are heavily booked, but it might be profitable to convert a building or two at each resort. Obviously, we'd have to know a lot about their costs and uses before any of us could comment on that. A rebuild/conversion is surely cheaper for DVD than new build.

I hope they don't tear down a building or two and then build something new which is larger (ala KT) because it won't fit the theming in either GF or the Poly.

[carolina_yankee]

For the Polynesian, I wonder if they would take out the Spirit of Aloha dinner area and build there, and also convert the lodges on that side of the marina - it would be a good way to keep the DVC and hotel sides separate, and DVC folk would be less likely to need the main building amenities.

For the Grand Floridian, I would guess they could either build more structures, or convert a couple, or both.

Dirk

[goofy4mickey]

DVC folk would be less likely to need the main building amenities

I would need my tonga toast. :laughing:

Good plan though - I would love a Poly DVC!! although I do love my BWV - but with a 1yo, it'll be nice to have a MK DVC option.

[carolina_yankee]

I would certainly be much more tempted for a Polynesian DVC than a KT DVC. That place is probably the most relaxing place on property . . .

Dirk

[goofy4mickey]

Me too - definitely more tempted on the Poly, but we'll probably buy at KT, too - I actually like the Contemporary - LOVE being able to walk to MK, and after watching wonderful world of disney growing up, both are pretty special to me. I'm hoping the rooms are as nice as AKV, too. and again, the 1yo - it'll be really nice walking to MK with him. But if both were available now, I'd so be at the Poly. LOL It is my absolute favorite resort theming wise.

[dianeschlicht]

To put my reasons into context please keep in mind that we've been owners since 1992. We certainly had a love affair with the mouse over that time. WDW was always such a magical place for us. It just gave us a feeling we couldn't describe. It just was a special place.

We had accumulated 1250 or so points and we had a plan to spend a month or more at WDW in the winters. After a frustrating go round with DVC and DVC legal regarding renting of points, which I won't detail, we sold of some of our contracts leaving us with one 350 point contract at SSR. We thought we would miss the points but you know what, we do not. I certainly don't miss the annual dues statements, LOL.

We've seen changes that have impacted our feelings for WDW/DVC. We have also changed over those years as well. We now desire a higher level of service/luxury. WDW isn't providing that for us any longer. We have lost that magical feeling we once had. We've watched the dining erode at WDW thanks to the DDP, we've seen the parks go from spotless to dirty restrooms/streets, we've seen a significant decline in the upkeep of DVC properties and regularly encounter problems with our room, we've asked for "To Go" orders to eat in room with our young son instaed of dragging him out to a sit down dinner and been told, NO thanks to the DDP, we've seen less than magical shift towards a sales focus with DVC rather than keeping the membership happy, we find the parks tired and unimaginative, etc. We have just lost that feeling for whatever reason. We actaully go one year to Disney parks and then the following year we stay at DVC and do Universal/Seaworld.

Also, I have serious concerns about the value of DVC going forward. I want to get out when prices are still stable. Who knows what the future holds but now I can get out without losing my shirt. Why should I own? IF we desire a trip there are tons of good choices in Orlando. Heck, I'll rent a three bedroom house with a pool and invite friends, who knows. I can rent points from a reliable owner. I can stay at the Ritz or Four Seasons, etc. Why should I let DVC hold my $25,000 PLUS pay them $120 a month in dues? I shouldn't and I won't.

I hope this answers it. It is a feeling we have coupled with a change in our desires when we travel. We never intended DVC as a long term thing anyway. We always viewed it as a use and dump program so we are now doing that. 16 years is a long time and I guess it has run it's course.



DAVE

I think that is exactly why we see so many OKW contracts on the market too. People have run their course with DVC.

Just an aside to your need for luxury and service....Have you thought of trying the AKV concierge level? It truly is that old fashioned service we loved prior to DVC when we were paying for the Deluxes. The good thing is, it combines that luxury and service with DVC 1 and 2 bedroom villas, which is a plus too.

[greenban]

I would certainly be much more tempted for a Polynesian DVC than a KT DVC. That place is probably the most relaxing place on property . . .

Dirk

I always wondered if the relaxing quality was actually the hypnotic side effect of the fungus throughout the main building. At least it sure smells like mold to me, everytime we enter!

-Tony

[Carolina]

I was excited about KT, but not so much anymore. I have to agree that the theming is not all that great. We have been considering a small add on there, but only because we like the location and would sometimes like to stay there. I am one who doesn't want to stay at the same resort every time I go.

Anyway - would much prefer Poly if they do build a DVC there. Maybe I'll just wait and see.

Off Topic - the other board seems to be banning a lot of people lately. Are you not allowed to mention MO over there?

[carolina_yankee]

Off Topic - the other board seems to be banning a lot of people lately. Are you not allowed to mention MO over there?

It's not advised to even try . . .


Dirk

[louisianatigger]

This is my first post here at MouseOwners,I really enjoy you reading all the information. Hope I dont get in any trouble for this post. the video is on wdw news today, scroll down to JOSE EBER UPDATE 4/17/2008. Good view of what Tower will look like from lake. Lots of good detail of lake side view.

[tomandrobin]

I was excited about KT, but not so much anymore. I have to agree that the theming is not all that great. We have been considering a small add on there, but only because we like the location and would sometimes like to stay there. I am one who doesn't want to stay at the same resort every time I go.

Anyway - would much prefer Poly if they do build a DVC there. Maybe I'll just wait and see.

Off Topic - the other board seems to be banning a lot of people lately. Are you not allowed to mention MO over there?

Try type out Mouse Owners to bypass the filter and see how fast it takes to end up in the penalty box!

[tomandrobin]

This is my first post here at MouseOwners,I really enjoy you reading all the information. Hope I dont get in any trouble for this post. the video is on wdw news today, scroll down to JOSE EBER UPDATE 4/17/2008. Good view of what Tower will look like from lake. Lots of good detail of lake side view.

Welcome to MouseOwners!

[louisianatigger]

Welcome to MouseOwners!

Thanks for the BIG WELCOME !!! I posted this same information on the other site, will see what happens.

[Daitcher]

I always wondered if the relaxing quality was actually the hypnotic side effect of the fungus throughout the main building. At least it sure smells like mold to me, everytime we enter!

-Tony


Ahhhh, yes, that smell of mold upon entering. They pipe in that smell because Disney Imagineers thought that tropical locations always have that smell. Authentic Hawaii they thought...........:blech:



DAVE

[carolina_yankee]

Thanks for the BIG WELCOME !!! I posted this same information on the other site, will see what happens.

I'm glad you found us - at least you'll have a home after you've been tough-love evicted. ;) They've been cleaning house over there, I hear.

Dirk

[louisianatigger]

DIRK, Just wanted to say that I enjoyed the post on KT floor plans . Lots a good information. Would there be any more plans we could see of the rest of the resort check in, resturants,shops?

[wdwcrazy]

We recentlyl stayed at AK concierge and it was a pleasure. The service was excellent, the food wonderfull and the extra attention to detail was delightful. With that said, I must still commend the Beach Club which is one of my contracts and my favorite resort. I always get treated with kid gloves and am greeted by the staff by name. They make me feel welcome. As far as paying for more vacations each year because of DVC that is not true for us. We were paying over $5000 a year to stay at the Yacht or Beach so now we just spend that $5000 going to other places and still manage to hit WDW at least 3-4 weeks a year.

Yes, there are certain things that Disney has slipped up on but someone has to tell them so they have the opportunity to fix it. If you don't tell them to fix the problem that is bothering you then you don't get to complain about them. Write letters they do listen. I wanted spring water in bottles at the DVC resorts as I don't like Dasani water but because of their contract with Coca Cola they couldn't bring Zephyrhills spring water into the hotels once the contract was signed. After writing a letter and sugggesting to them that we have always been told that DVC is a separate entity than Disney World why not allow it at DVC resorts. I received a phone call from a VP who checked into the legality of this and they realized they could put the water into DVC resorts as it didn't break the coke contract. So my complaining worked and now I have my spring water for my tea in the morning and to fill my water bottles when I go to the parks.

DVC people have the power to make changes and I am sorry that the magic has been lost for some. Maybe someday it will return in the meantime I will continue to believe in the Mouse and will certainly be one of the crazies in line to add on just a few more points at KT.

[Steamboat Bill]

Just an offical welcome to the many DISboard viewers reading over here at MOs.

Why not register and join the friendliest DVC forum on the web!

-Tony


I will second that "Official" welcome...(check your spelling Tony! or use Firefox).


Dis has become an autocratic cesspool of endless rules and behavioral strictures, designed to eliminate debate and prevent dissemination of useful information.

Quite frankly, many Dis members are vehemently anti-rental...and they seem to join here to try spread their nonsense... I actually enjoy being able to respond here to some of their ridiculous postings without fear that I will get "10 point infractions", etc.

Great description of DIS.

For the record...I am "Pro-rental"

Have any of you long time members (notice greenban I did not say older) thought of trying to get on the DVC board??? Is that even possible. :idontgeti You guys could really shake things up for the better.

Yes, we have. You need a different e-mail address and different computer IP address.

Come on, even angry Drawfs with small dental picks can't really suggest that a post containing Googling Instructions violates DER posting guidelines!

So that is DIS's problem...small dental pick syndrome.

[PolyColleen]

We have enough points and enough dues that Kingdom Tower hasn't even tempted me to buy more, although I do hope that after the first fuss dies down, I will get to stay there. But the thought of POLY DVC is enough to make me start wondering how I could put an add-on onto my Disney credit card without DH finding out...

I LOVE LOVE LOVE the Poly. I ENJOY that smell upon entering the lobby even if it IS mold. I love the view from the beach and the tacky tikis and the beautiful flowers everywhere. My husband says the place is "too 1970s" but that is also part of why I love it... I have been going there since the 1970s and when I am there I feel like a kid again. In fact I have informed my significant other that if a teeny part of my cremains do not wind up on that very beach, I will do my best to haunt him.

Every time we visit WDW we walk the path from Poly to GF and back again. That path is my favorite piece of real estate in the whole World. There is lots of room for new buildings, although not sure about the additional parking. There would also be room to the other side, closer to the ticket center, if they knocked down a building or two -- although the TTC view is not near as nifty as the one toward the Wedding Pavilion.

Also -- if they build a footbridge over the canal where they park the EWP barge, both DVC GF and DVC Poly WOULD be "walk to the MK" resorts. That would be very cool! I am going to start saying little prayers for Poly DVC. Shan, I will see you there!

[carolina_yankee]

DIRK, Just wanted to say that I enjoyed the post on KT floor plans . Lots a good information. Would there be any more plans we could see of the rest of the resort check in, resturants,shops?

We posted everything we have. If we get anymore info, we'll certainly get it up there.

I'm sure they know where the shops are going, but they may not yet have the build outs worked out yet - how many shops, how much space per shop, that kind of thing.

Dirk

[lenshanem]

Shan, I will see you there!:fingerscr

[JaneBanks]

I've been waiting on the announcement for KT, my DS and I would both love it.
But reading speculation about Poly DVC???

Crap, I better save, save, save. We love the Poly too!

[Steamboat Bill]

I've been waiting on the announcement for KT, my DS and I would both love it.
But reading speculation about Poly DVC???

Crap, I better save, save, save. We love the Poly too!

Me too....

[KevGuy]

Wow, no way there is another forum board for Disney?? I thought the universe started and ended here!!:scratchch:bowdown:

I'll have you know a couple of weeks ago on my trip I wore my MO t-shirt at epcot and MK (yes I washed it in between, I can do that as a dvc member lol) and had several people come up and ask about the site and a couple say they have seen my posts. Yes, I took the liberty of putting my forum name on the back with the magic of iron on. :doublekis Common theme was everyone loves this place!!:clappingh

[JimP]

For the Polynesian, I wonder if they would take out the Spirit of Aloha dinner area and build there, and also convert the lodges on that side of the marina - it would be a good way to keep the DVC and hotel sides separate, and DVC folk would be less likely to need the main building amenities.

Dirk,

They could build a series of SSLTs (seven seas lagoon towers) on the Polynesian property... and change the theme to Honolulu.

/Jim

[rlcarmichael]

Now here is my question - where in the world would they add a DVC at the Poly and the GF?!? I thought this has been discussed before and the general thought was there was no room. I'm assuming they would have to convert some existing buildings? I guess at the GF it could be built next to the parking across the street, but at the Poly?!?

I thought the same thing about KT@CR, BLT or whatever the name is this week. But what looked like it was going to be a rehab to the MK side garden wing turned out to be new construction.

I'd love to call Poly home! It's my fav resort, and where I USED to stay BEFORE DVC added that stupid $95 reservation fee. It WOULD take some careful planning not to ruin the south pacific feel with the "just another beach resort town" look but if anybody can pull it off...

I'm thinking about buying into the sandwich just for the 11 month booking window on the monorail. I think booking there will be really tough otherwise. Thoughts of Poly or GF DVC make me wonder if I should wait.

Off Topic - the other board seems to be banning a lot of people lately. Are you not allowed to mention MO over there?

Oh, and BTW, I got warned on that OTHER unnamed board for a post which answered the original poster's question with a link to another board with cruise info which just happened to be sponsored by a travel agent NOT the one that OTHER board's travel agent sponsor.

No welcome...just warning that my post had been DELETED and I had points against me and I would be banned for a month if I got anymore. You would have thought I had posted a link to kiddy porn or something.

Well I haven't been back there. They can kiss my "almost banned"...

[spiceycat]

this is just too funny.

got a warning because I didn't post a link. told them to email me instead.

house rentals.

I still like the Orlando hotels./attractions - first the moderators don't pay that much attention to it. So things get say there that would probably be banned on the other boards.

learned lots of great tips - skyauction and a few others - might also have learned them on tug. did learned them on the dis.

If I can will buy at KT - but if money is a problem and looks like it will be - will pass on it.

was going to sell part of my DVC points - so no 2-bedrooms any longer - my brother acted like he was in pain and dieing.... so still might. just won't tell him - besides his getting a 2-bedroom is long gone. the kids are gone or will be soon.

would love the Polyn!!! It was for years my favorite WDW resort - even after I joined DVC. then one year, about 6 years after becoming a member of DVC, - we stayed there.

the entire time mother kept bring up things that OKW had that the Polyn didn't....
she missed OKW big time.

that was the last time we stayed in a WDW resort on points. Now with cash have stayed at several wdw resorts mostly - value and moderates. but found my second love at Pop Century. Hate to say it but it PC existed in 1993 don't know if I would have brought DVC.

now if not staying at a DVC resort, it is Pop Century or offsite.

now back to the Polyn. A couple of years ago with the mold problem that the Polyn had - would not be surprised at some of those building becoming DVC. that did NOT happen. So really can't see any of Polyn becoming a DVC in the next 10 years. Not when they let those units get away.

Disney spend a fortune fixing up the Polyn. can't see the them even starting a DVC unit here until they get the pay back. Even at $400 a night - that will be a long time coming.

the plans that had DVC going near the luva were before the wedding pavillion went up. there is not enough room there to build a DVC big enough. You know that a Polyn DVC will be very, very popular. DVC would have to build at least as big as BCV - there isn't room.

someone say the valet parking - but again that is not a big area. So far the DVC units are the same height as the WDW resorts. A tower just won't look right in the Polyn.

would love where the Tahiti is - but that is a long wait too... think they rehab the Tahiti before they started the mold issue problem.
-----------

Greenban - any comments about the South Wing. Some people think it will be a DVC resort - thought it was to go to CR, for suites for the convention area.

--------------

If you haven't have problems at WL because we are DVC and not WDW guests count yourself luck.

everytime I go have to fight for my room. they kept wanting me to stay in one of the studios with a view of the service area. will not accept any of those rooms. the sad part is that they have other rooms in very, very nice section. they just kept pushing DVC members to take the worst. they want to give the nicer units to their PAYING guests. which is not what my contract says.

So it is not a surprise that first BC and now AK - will have their own check in area. So hopefully this,' DVC members should receive the worst attitude' - won't be happening.

now if they would only do at VWL - would be happy!!!

the hotels do look at DVC as competition - hey they are losing their best and longest customers to DVC.

[Pumpkinboy]

...Dis has become an autocratic cesspool of endless rules and behavioral strictures, designed to eliminate debate and prevent dissemination of useful information...
DavidDo I lose my pool-hopping privileges by swimming in the "cesspool"? ;)

Seariously, BLT having its own check-in (perhaps sandwich themed?) is probably a good idea anyway, given the size of the development.

I kinda like the BWV and VB styles of setup, where DVC is the dominant component and the hotel part is secondary. There at least CMs know which side of the toast the butter is on.

[Daitcher]

Do I lose my pool-hopping privileges by swimming in the "cesspool"? ;)

Seariously, BLT having its own check-in (perhaps sandwich themed?) is probably a good idea anyway, given the size of the development.

I kinda like the BWV and VB styles of setup, where DVC is the dominant component and the hotel part is secondary. There at least CMs know which side of the toast the butter is on.



Nice post. I like the sandwiched reference!

I just wanted to say that VB is entirely Vacation Club. There is no hotel component there. The OVIR are the rooms that I'm sure you arree referring to and those are DVC as well just a different configuration. They can be booked on points. BWI/BWV are different. You cannot use points to stay on the Inn side just like BCV/BC.

Also, the bread is buttered with cash guests. In my experiences being a cash guest versus DVC, I have felt FAR more valued as a cash guest. DVC are the black sheep at WDW in the eyes of many CM's.


DAVE

[tomandrobin]

Baaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh!!!


Not feeling the CM Love!

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r197/tomandrobin/smileys/sheep.gif

[rlcarmichael]

Also, the bread is buttered with cash guests. In my experiences being a cash guest versus DVC, I have felt FAR more valued as a cash guest. DVC are the black sheep at WDW in the eyes of many CM's.

DAVE

That is TOTALLY wrong. We come more often, we require less house keeping service, and I'm willing to bet we spend more per day than an average guest.

I haven't had that experience but you can be assured that someone will hear about it if I do.

[JimP]

Also, the bread is buttered with cash guests. In my experiences being a cash guest versus DVC, I have felt FAR more valued as a cash guest. DVC are the black sheep at WDW in the eyes of many CM's.

I have not noticed a difference.

/Jim

[Daitcher]

I have not noticed a difference.

/Jim



You probably won't UNLESS you have a problem. Cash guests are treated far better in these regards and in the end made to feel special. DVC members get nothing but a half hearted apology when problems occur.

I've experienced it firsthand many times over the years. I had a problem with my room at the GF. They apologized over and over again and then moved us into the PRESIDENTIAL suite to make up for it. We also received an apology letter that night with a desert tray. This was over a room with a few minor issues; AC and plumbing. It has also happened during a stay at BC. We checked into a room that was already occupied. They immediately and swiftly made it right going the extra mile and putting us into a concierge room.

I've had similiar problems over my 40+ DVC stays and not once have I had anything done, sometimes not even an apology.

There IS a distinct difference in how you are treated at the resort. Check ins are somehow a little less magical and when problems occur I've seen a HUGE difference in the handling of those problems. Black sheep may be a little harsh but I've also heard directly from CM's that DVC owners are viewed in a negative light at WDW. We are viewed as whining, complainers with a sense of false entitlement. To some degree I'd have to agree.


DAVE

[JimP]

You probably won't UNLESS you have a problem. Cash guests are treated far better in these regards and in the end made to feel special. DVC members get nothing but a half hearted apology when problems occur.

I've experienced it firsthand many times over the years. I had a problem with my room at the GF. They apologized over and over again and then moved us into the PRESIDENTIAL suite to make up for it. We also received an apology letter that night with a desert tray. This was over a room with a few minor issues; AC and plumbing. It has also happened during a stay at BC. We checked into a room that was already occupied. They immediately and swiftly made it right going the extra mile and putting us into a concierge room.

I've had similiar problems over my 40+ DVC stays and not once have I had anything done, sometimes not even an apology.

There IS a distinct difference in how you are treated at the resort. Check ins are somehow a little less magical and when problems occur I've seen a HUGE difference in the handling of those problems. Black sheep may be a little harsh but I've also heard directly from CM's that DVC owners are viewed in a negative light at WDW. We are viewed as whining, complainers with a sense of false entitlement. To some degree I'd have to agree.


DAVE

Interesting comments. The only time we ended up with a room that required a move (water problems in bathroom)... they moved us promptly... and even ensured that we had a 1BR that was part of a lockoff... so that we could simply open the door during the upcoming portion of our trip.

There was one time I would have liked to change a room... and considered a request... but didn't do so because I didn't want to repack and move. This was just room location. We were at BWV in the dedicated 2BR right over the laundry. We heard the constant beeping of trucks backing up to the loading area all night.

/Jim

/Jim

[bigbahamadada]

You probably won't UNLESS you have a problem. Cash guests are treated far better in these regards and in the end made to feel special. DVC members get nothing but a half hearted apology when problems occur. DAVE

This description doesn't jive with my recent experience.

As I noted on another post, when we arrived for check-in last week at BCV, the manager came over and very apologetically informed us that the room they intended for us was unavailable because the prior occupants had self-extended by not yet checking out. He explained that they had tried unsuccessfully to contact the individuals, had locked them out of the room but couldn't remove their items. He also said that, having had been in the room himself, it was going to take several hours until it was ready for a new occupant. So, without me so much as a gripe from us, he personally escorted us over to 2 bedroom conceirege suite at Yacht Club. And, again without asking, they refunded the 34 points for missed night of the stay -- actually moving them back into the use year from which they had been borrowed. And the DVC room was available very early the next morning. Couldn't have been happier with the level and quality of communication.

Contrast that with some less than helpful experiences we've had as cash guests at WL. I think it is the CM that matters -- not whether you are DVC or cash.

[Blue&Gold]

I think it is the CM that matters -- not whether you are DVC or cash.


And, as in most things, leadership is key. When I get a hearty "Welcome Home" at the gate or at the front desk, I gain the impression that both the CM is well versed in their job and that their management is interested in perpetuating the positive vibe created by the "home away from home" schtick.

[carolina_yankee]

I have to say that I think the differential treatment between cash and points guest is fairly rare. Of course, I say that because it hasn't happened to me. However, I have to say, this is lukewarm praise because I had friends traveling this trip who got pretty crappy treatment from check-in at PO-R as cash guests.

Yet, when I checked in about an hour after them, the CM helping me not only worked with me, but fixed our friends problems as well - taking time to get a manager to be sure that all the changes went smoothly. For the record, both CMs were college program, and both had about 3 months experience under their belt.

The only place I've gotten questionable front-desk service was BW, and there, concierge intercepted right away saying "We're not busy come over here. It will be easier for everyone."

At BCV, we were seated in a sitting room, given lemeon water and cookies, and relaxed while our check-in was processed. What service! At SSR, we were promptly greeted with a smile by a CM hostess who chatted with us during our wait and escorted us to the next available check-in CM. The CM processed our friends and us at the same time, over riding the room assignments to give us our requests without so much as a frown.

Then again, we did ride on the bus with someone who thought SSR was run down, shabby, and had lousy service. They fussed that there was no daily housekeeping and that they had to request shampoo refills and were charged for them. They claimed to be DVC owners of many years, yet they didn't quite get how the program works.

Anyone can have a bad experience, and folks who travel frequently will have more bad experiences than the average guest, but I generally find that a friendly attitude goes a long way towards solving problems, and I've learned to quickly bypass a less than magical CM by asking for a manager.

Dirk

[TW1]

Then again, we did ride on the bus with someone who thought SSR was run down, shabby, and had lousy service. They fussed that there was no daily housekeeping and that they had to request shampoo refills and were charged for them. They claimed to be DVC owners of many years, yet they didn't quite get how the program works.


Were they carrying Royal Caribbean tote bags by any chance?

[carolina_yankee]

Were they carrying Royal Caribbean tote bags by any chance?

No, but he had just lost his iPhone. I have to think that had something to do with his mood. :cellphone

Why, do you know any particular tote bags we might want avoid? ;)

Dirk

[NYDVC]

Were they carrying Royal Caribbean tote bags by any chance?

great TW!!:laughing::laughing:

[greenban]

No, but he had just lost his iPhone. I have to think that had something to do with his mood. :cellphone

Why, do you know any particular tote bags we might want avoid? ;)

Dirk

I have heard that certain TOTE bags may smell of sewage, and are carried by Morons, who step on injured toes and who don't know about tipping the bathroom attendents with large pink mints to get paper towel animals in return while renting distressed DVC points for less than maintenance fees!

It is also rumored that the male of said species (Nasty Northeastern, Entitled, DVC Owners) have on occassion locked themselves out on the balcony (by jamming the sliding door) for hours on end!!

Well, that's what I heard!

-Tony

[carolina_yankee]

I'm behind in my MO reading, but I finally caught the meaning of the TW1 post. So, Tony, do you think we've discovered Webmaster Doc's real name?

[greenban]

I'm behind in my MO reading, but I finally caught the meaning of the TW1 post. So, Tony, do you think we've discovered Webmaster Doc's real name?

:iagree:

Yup.

BTW, WDW is a perfect excuse for failing behind your MOing!

-Tony

[dschieber]

Tony,

Come on Deep Croaker!
Where's our Grand Californian insider info?
Points, Price, Sales Date, etc.
You did such a fantastic job on AKV info.

Thanks, Deb

[tomandrobin]

Tony,

Come on Deep Croaker!
Where's our Grand Californian insider info?
Points, Price, Sales Date, etc.
You did such a fantastic job on AKV info.

Thanks, Deb

Wrong coast maybe?

[JimP]

Wrong coast maybe?

Tom,

The opposite of "right" is "left" in this case... not "wrong".

/Jim (sticking up for the minority west coasters here! :)

[tomandrobin]

sticking up for the minority west coasters here! :)

You "Other" Coasters might be in the minority for now, but with GCV and Hawaii coming on board, your numbers will grow. And don't think your little recruiting of "other" coasters has not gone unnoticed! :reporter:

Pretty soon will be crawling with "other" coasters! :troll: :beaniepro :tilt: :cone: :coffee2:

[greenban]

Tom,

The opposite of "right" is "left" in this case... not "wrong".

/Jim (sticking up for the minority west coasters here! :)

Jim:

Congrats on your 1 BR status.

Of course that would be a 2 BR on the correct (right) coast!

-Tony

[JimP]

Jim:

Congrats on your 1 BR status.

Of course that would be a 2 BR on the correct (right) coast!

-Tony

At this rate I will be a 2BR guy in less than a month. Too bad we don't get DVC point bonuses as our status increases :)

/Jim

[TW1]

sticking up for the minority west coasters here! :)

Well, lets see, when the Hawaii resort opens, and locals there join and sign on, can we consider them the new West Coast? Then that would make JimP et al the middle coast, right?

[NYDVC]

Any any member with a motor home would be roller coasters :jumpingbe

[XPhillip]

And all of us in the middle would be "No Coasters"

[dsruton]

I Love the "No Coasters" Being from Ohio "Coasts are almost non existant (sp)!!!

[TW1]

And all of us in the middle would be "No Coasters"

Why not improvise and be Drink Coasters!

[greenban]

Why not improvise and be Drink Coasters!

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41D2JX20XXL._SL500_AA240_.jpg

http://www.absorbentprinting.com/images/categories/cid1-coaster.jpg

http://www.freshtrend.com/images/044.jpg

http://i19.ebayimg.com/03/i/000/b6/58/ff38_2.JPG

-Towdw

[cincinmouse]

I Love the "No Coasters" Being from Ohio "Coasts are almost non existant (sp)!!!

What are you talking about. We have plenty of "coasters" here in OHIO. Some of the best. We have the Beast which is the #1 wooden "Coaster" in the US and Cedar Point in Sandusky is know as the "Coaster" capital of the world!:hahahaha:

Cedar Point is a 364 acre (1.5 km²) amusement park located in Sandusky, Ohio, U.S. on a narrow peninsula jutting into Lake Erie. It currently holds the world record for most roller coasters with 17, one of them being the world's second tallest and second fastest roller coaster, Top Thrill Dragster, which reaches speeds of 120 mph and a height of 420 feet. Cedar Point is also the only amusement park with four roller coasters that are taller than 200 feet

[greenban]

What are you talking about. We have plenty of "coasters" here in OHIO. Some of the best. We have the Beast which is the #1 wooden "Coaster" in the US and Cedar Point in Sandusky is know as the "Coaster" capital of the world!:hahahaha:

Cedar Point is a 364 acre (1.5 km²) amusement park located in Sandusky, Ohio, U.S. on a narrow peninsula jutting into Lake Erie. It currently holds the world record for most roller coasters with 17, one of them being the world's second tallest and second fastest roller coaster, Top Thrill Dragster, which reaches speeds of 120 mph and a height of 420 feet. Cedar Point is also the only amusement park with four roller coasters that are taller than 200 feet

Some of Oh High O's greatest coasters:

1) The Ohio Buckeye SplashDown!
http://img71.photobucket.com/albums/v216/spinnerau1/Snopes/Wet_roller_coaster.jpg


2) The Ohio Falls Down Coaster!
http://www.photoshoptalent.com/images/contests/rollercoaster/fullsize/rollercoaster_4760b0e8ad15a.jpg


3) The Put the Petal Down!
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/129/421878656_147242ec01_o.jpg


4) The Ohio Fall Down!
http://ursispaltenstein.ch/blog/images/uploads_img/game_fantasy_rollercoaster.jpg

-ToWdw

[cincinmouse]

I don't think those are the ones,

These are more like it.

WICKED TWISTER
http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk159/cincinmouse/untitled2.jpg

TOP FUEL DRAGSTER
http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk159/cincinmouse/untitled.jpg

[greenban]

I don't think those are the ones,

These are more like it.

WICKED TWISTER
http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk159/cincinmouse/untitled2.jpg

TOP FUEL DRAGSTER
http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk159/cincinmouse/untitled.jpg


I like mine better ;)

-Tony